[Ashlar2006]

I was reading a question on line somewhere about a Man who wanted to become a Mason , but stated he kept no secrets from his wife so he could not become one . So this had me thinking on this .

I have secrets other than Freemasonry that I do not tell my wife . I have things that I have had friends confide in me whom told me not to tell anyone else . I have kept these secrets from her as they are not none of her business . She has secrets that her friends have confided in her that she has not told me and I understand that they are none of my business . I also have something that I have shared with no one , when before my grandfather died , we had a long , heartfelt talk that I keep deep in my heart and mind and I feel that this was something between me and him and if I tell someone the details of this talk it would spoil it for me . It is mine and mine alone .

My wife understands why we keep these secrets on all levels . She knows that it is a way to recognize true brothers . She also recognizes and understands the reasoning behind it , in that it proves that it is a means of proving that we are men of our word and completely backs me up on my membership in the Fraternity . As she told me , it is none of her business

If spouses have complete trust in one another , is it wrong to keep personal secrets from one another ? Is there nothing that we can call our own or must we share everything with our wives and husbands ? Must we pry into every aspect of each others lives ? Can we not be married to loving spouses and still be individuals ?

Take my wife , she and her friends have girls night out . I trust and love her completely so I do not pry into what they had done or where they have been . If she wants to tell me , then she can , if not then it is none of my business . I feel sorry for those who have husbands and wives who thinks one another must think they should know every aspect of each others lives . Maybe it is just me , but I think that we should still , even though we are married , retain a little piece of ourselves that we can call our own that does not include our spouses . I think it keeps a marriage healthy to have places to go and things to do that does not include the other , to unplug and to recharge our own batteries .

What is everyone's thoughts on this . I would love to hear some of the women 's thoughts on this . Now mind you , I am only talking about benign secrets , not infidelities and the like

[Jason]

I trust my wife and she trusts me. We do not divulge every secret to each other, although are pretty open with each other.

[Ashlar2006]

So , you are saying as long as it is not something that would hurt your marriage , such as an infidelity , then it is alright to keep a few secrets from each other , something personal that you would want to keep to yourself or because it is something someone confided to you and vice versa ?

I am open with my wife also , I talk about Masonry with her all the time . Things that old timers would not like me too , but are not secret one way or another . In a long ago thread we had a conversation a long these lines and I was talking about how my uncle thought anything and everything that goes on in lodge is secret , when that could not be further from the truth . There is much we can talk about when it comes to Freemasonry and as long as I open about what I can talk about helps out a lot .

[Custer148]

Ashlar, my wife completely supports me going to lodge and having a guy's night out, just as she has time with her girl friends. We keep secrets from each other that will not hurt our marriage, and we respect each others privilege of those secrets. I think as you do that it is a necessary thing that we don't have to tell everything we did unless we want to.

[SeeOnFarm]

. This is an interesting conversation. I feel "secrets" of infidelity, or anything along that line fall into not one, but two categories; 1. it can be a secret if you so choose ( assuming that one doesn't tell in fear of the consequences ) but I think more than that; 2. ( and of most importance ) it is "betrayal" first, and a "secret" second (again if one so chooses to make it ......)

The "secrets" that a mason may keep (or must keep ) either by simple tradition or by an inherent "rule" to the membership, may be secret, but it is not deception. I believe it's easy to confuse one with the other. For instance, if my wife asked me; "did you eat all the chips-ahoy?" and I say "NO", and I DID, that is not a secret, it is a bold face lie. On the other hand, if my wife asked me; "what are you working on at work" and my reply is simply "honey, you know I'm not suppose to talk about that stuff", that is the TRUTH. The facts that must be present to satisfy that question may be "omitted" (regardless of the regulation one is required to follow) and become "secret"........but it's NOT a LIE. And it's the deception I feel is what's wrong, not a "secret". That is my view on this topic. However, I understand the concern, especially if one has never been put in the position where they are REQUIRED to harbor information. But this is a common thing. Doctors can't talk to their wives about patients (you wouldn't want them to), therapists can't talk to their wives about their patients ( again...would you want them to?) and Lawyers, they can't divulge information about their clients. This is simply an example taken from a business prospective. To site an example from a more "personal" stand point, if my wife thought that I had bad breath, sure she could tell me, but she doesn't because she is "protecting" my feelings, much like a "secret" in the Masonic community also protects. It protects the establishments integrity, it's purpose, and hopefully aids it. I suppose I could go on forever about this, I don't seem to be winding down so I'll end it here.

I do believe we keep secrets. More than we may be aware. And for more reasons than one. I believe it's the REASON that justifies the means.

I have enjoyed this site and appreciate being able to participate in these discussions. It shames most other things we come across on the internet.

Thanks.

[Ashlar2006]

Very astute answer Seeonfarm , I like it . This is why I stated "benign" secrets . In other words I am not keeping secrets from my wife for the purpose of deceiving her or sneaking around doing things behind her back that would jeopardize our marriage or trust . It is simply something that was intrusted to me to protect and nothing more .

[Jason]

Originally Posted by Ashlar521

So , you are saying as long as it is not something that would hurt your marriage , such as an infidelity , then it is alright to keep a few secrets from each other , something personal that you would want to keep to yourself or because it is something someone confided to you and vice versa ?

I am open with my wife also , I talk about Masonry with her all the time . Things that old timers would not like me too , but are not secret one way or another . In a long ago thread we had a conversation a long these lines and I was talking about how my uncle thought anything and everything that goes on in lodge is secret , when that could not be further from the truth . There is much we can talk about when it comes to Freemasonry and as long as I open about what I can talk about helps out a lot .

You are making my head hurt, late night, not enough coffee yet. Yeah, I would not keep anything from my wife that would hurt her like infidelity.

My wife comes from an interesting family, and while she is supportive, she really does not ask much. I've told her all my books are open to her that are on my shelf to read, but she has no interest. Now after I went into the Shriners, and they allowed wives and family to be there, and she got to meet a lot of the ladies down there and talk to them, she has shown some interest. But the way our local Shriners interact with family versus our Lodge, is a whole other story.

I am still nervous when it comes to talking about Masonry though. My Brothers keep telling me it is the words, handshakes, and certain phrases that are all are "secret". But when it comes to the workings of the Lodge, or how you progress, I get nervous.

[Ashlar2006]

OK , that works , and sorry I made you head hurt LOL .

To simplify this , we will leave out all talk about the "bad secrets" such as infidelities etc; etc ; And only those secrets that pertain to Freemasonry and what has been confided to you by a friend or family member .

I will make it easier and relate as to what I do not talk to my wife about , which would be signs , words , grips and ritual (which would be anything from how we prepare the candidate , how the candidate is conducted , wording of ritual etc; etc; ) and how I voted on a petitioner . Everything else is fare game . And I too had told her that all my books that set beside my chair are open to her to read with the exception of my rituals .

From what I have read of England , they can even talk to their wives about the ritual itself . One Mason on line has stated that his wife helps him study the ritual . Only modes of recognition are truly secret .

[East_Regalia]

As part of his obligation as a Mason, he swears that he will not reveal the secrets entrusted to him. Therefore, if he feels he is holding back "secrets" from his wife by taking such an Obligation, then in my opinion, perhaps Freemasonry is not suitable for him.

[Ashlar2006]

This is true but not the point of the thread . We all know if one feels he can not keep anything from his wife then Freemasonry is not for him . I have even told men asking for petitions this . Why I started this thread was to pose the question " Must we tell our spouses every little detail of our lives ?" . Not only concerning Freemasonry , but with things a friend may have told them in confidence . Is there not a part of us that we can call our own without including our wives and they us ?

Take myself for example , if the wife goes out with her girlfriends , I do not ask where they went and what they done , if she wants to tell me then that is fine . If she does not then it is none of my business . I trust her and that is all that is needed for me .

If a man feels he can not join Freemasonry because he will not keep secrets from his wife , then this is a man I would never want to confide in as he would run home and tell her something I did not want anyone else to know .