I was reading a question on line somewhere about a Man who wanted to become a Mason , but stated he kept no secrets from his wife so he could not become one . So this had me thinking on this . I have secrets other than Freemasonry that I do not tell my wife . I have things that I have had friends confide in me whom told me not to tell anyone else . I have kept these secrets from her as they are not none of her business . She has secrets that her friends have confided in her that she has not told me and I understand that they are none of my business . My wife understands why we keep these secrets on all levels . She knows that it is a way to recognize true brothers . She also recognizes and understands the reasoning behind it , in that it proves that it is a means of proving that we are men of our word and completely backs me up on my membership in the Fraternity . As she told me , it is none of her business If spouses have complete trust in one another , is it wrong to keep personal secrets from one another ? Is there nothing that we can call our own or must we share everything with our wives and husbands ? Must we pry into every aspect of each others lives ? Can we not be married to loving spouses and still be individuals ? Take my wife , she and her friends have girls night out . I trust and love her completely so I do not pry into what they had done or where they have been . If she wants to tell me , then she can , if not then it is none of my business . I feel sorry for those who have husbands and wives who thinks one another must think they should know every aspect of each others lives . Maybe it is just me , but I think that we should still , even though we are married , retain a little piece of ourselves that we can call our own that does not include our spouses . I think it keeps a marriage healthy to have places to go and things to do that does not include the other , to unplug and to recharge our own batteries . What is everyone's thoughts on this . I would love to hear some of the women 's thoughts on this . Now mind you , I am only talking about benign secrets , not infidelities and the like
I trust my wife and she trusts me. We do not divulge every secret to each other, although are pretty open with each other.
So , you are saying as long as it is not something that would hurt your marriage , such as an infidelity , then it is alright to keep a few secrets from each other , something personal that you would want to keep to yourself or because it is something someone confided to you and vice versa ? I am open with my wife also , I talk about Masonry with her all the time . Things that old timers would not like me too , but are not secret one way or another . In a long ago thread we had a conversation a long these lines and I was talking about how my uncle thought anything and everything that goes on in lodge is secret , when that could not be further from the truth . There is much we can talk about when it comes to Freemasonry and as long as I open about what I can talk about helps out a lot .
Ashlar, my wife completely supports me going to lodge and having a guy's night out, just as she has time with her girl friends. We keep secrets from each other that will not hurt our marriage, and we respect each others privilege of those secrets. I think as you do that it is a necessary thing that we don't have to tell everything we did unless we want to.
. This is an interesting conversation. I feel "secrets" of infidelity, or anything along that line fall into not one, but two categories; 1. it can be a secret if you so choose ( assuming that one doesn't tell in fear of the consequences ) but I think more than that; 2. ( and of most importance ) it is "betrayal" first, and a "secret" second (again if one so chooses to make it ......) The "secrets" that a mason may keep (or must keep ) either by simple tradition or by an inherent "rule" to the membership, may be secret, but it is not deception. I believe it's easy to confuse one with the other. For instance, if my wife asked me; "did you eat all the chips-ahoy?" and I say "NO", and I DID, that is not a secret, it is a bold face lie. On the other hand, if my wife asked me; "what are you working on at work" and my reply is simply "honey, you know I'm not suppose to talk about that stuff", that is the TRUTH. The facts that must be present to satisfy that question may be "omitted" (regardless of the regulation one is required to follow) and become "secret"........but it's NOT a LIE. And it's the deception I feel is what's wrong, not a "secret". That is my view on this topic. However, I understand the concern, especially if one has never been put in the position where they are REQUIRED to harbor information. But this is a common thing. Doctors can't talk to their wives about patients (you wouldn't want them to), therapists can't talk to their wives about their patients ( again...would you want them to?) and Lawyers, they can't divulge information about their clients. This is simply an example taken from a business prospective. To site an example from a more "personal" stand point, if my wife thought that I had bad breath, sure she could tell me, but she doesn't because she is "protecting" my feelings, much like a "secret" in the Masonic community also protects. It protects the establishments integrity, it's purpose, and hopefully aids it. I suppose I could go on forever about this, I don't seem to be winding down so I'll end it here. I do believe we keep secrets. More than we may be aware. And for more reasons than one. I believe it's the REASON that justifies the means. I have enjoyed this site and appreciate being able to participate in these discussions. It shames most other things we come across on the internet. Thanks.
Very astute answer Seeonfarm , I like it . This is why I stated "benign" secrets . In other words I am not keeping secrets from my wife for the purpose of deceiving her or sneaking around doing things behind her back that would jeopardize our marriage or trust . It is simply something that was intrusted to me to protect and nothing more .
You are making my head hurt, late night, not enough coffee yet. Yeah, I would not keep anything from my wife that would hurt her like infidelity. My wife comes from an interesting family, and while she is supportive, she really does not ask much. I've told her all my books are open to her that are on my shelf to read, but she has no interest. Now after I went into the Shriners, and they allowed wives and family to be there, and she got to meet a lot of the ladies down there and talk to them, she has shown some interest. But the way our local Shriners interact with family versus our Lodge, is a whole other story. I am still nervous when it comes to talking about Masonry though. My Brothers keep telling me it is the words, handshakes, and certain phrases that are all are "secret". But when it comes to the workings of the Lodge, or how you progress, I get nervous.
OK , that works , and sorry I made you head hurt LOL . To simplify this , we will leave out all talk about the "bad secrets" such as infidelities etc; etc ; And only those secrets that pertain to Freemasonry and what has been confided to you by a friend or family member . I will make it easier and relate as to what I do not talk to my wife about , which would be signs , words , grips and ritual (which would be anything from how we prepare the candidate , how the candidate is conducted , wording of ritual etc; etc; ) and how I voted on a petitioner . Everything else is fare game . And I too had told her that all my books that set beside my chair are open to her to read with the exception of my rituals . From what I have read of England , they can even talk to their wives about the ritual itself . One Mason on line has stated that his wife helps him study the ritual . Only modes of recognition are truly secret .
Obligation As part of his obligation as a Mason, he swears that he will not reveal the secrets entrusted to him. Therefore, if he feels he is holding back "secrets" from his wife by taking such an Obligation, then in my opinion, perhaps Freemasonry is not suitable for him.
This is true but not the point of the thread . We all know if one feels he can not keep anything from his wife then Freemasonry is not for him . I have even told men asking for petitions this . Why I started this thread was to pose the question " Must we tell our spouses every little detail of our lives ?" . Not only concerning Freemasonry , but with things a friend may have told them in confidence . Is there not a part of us that we can call our own without including our wives and they us ? Take myself for example , if the wife goes out with her girlfriends , I do not ask where they went and what they done , if she wants to tell me then that is fine . If she does not then it is none of my business . I trust her and that is all that is needed for me . If a man feels he can not join Freemasonry because he will not keep secrets from his wife , then this is a man I would never want to confide in as he would run home and tell her something I did not want anyone else to know .
I think SeeOnFarm nailed it on the head when he made the distinction between a secret and a deception (lie). Trade secrets or sensative informaton related to work is a good example. My wife knows that there are projects I've worked on in the past that she can not know the details about. Even things as trivial as passwords related to my accounts at work. (which may be a good comparison to lodge secrets) Personally, I think it is ok for my wife to simply know there are details related to rituals, identification of Masons to each other, etc that cannot be revealed. That is ok. She knows the gist of the information I am withholding and WHY I withhold it from her. MUCH different then hiding something from her.
new member here just found the site, My wife respects mystatements when i tell her that I swore an oath to protect the information I as given(grips etc).All I have in this world is my name and my honor and to break an oath freely given would ruin both and show my wife that even she should not trust me for I swore an oath to her when i married her.
I'm lucky enough to have married the daughter of a 32nd degree Mason so she completely understands that there are some things I can't share with her. I also consider myself lucky to be a Mason in Massachusetts because WM gifted me the "Massachusetts Freemason's Handbook". I read it cover to cover in the first few days after I received it and refer to it frequently. The Handbook says I can and should share it with my wife and family so they can understand what I'm doing and it contains no secrets of the Craft. This gives me a clear limit to what I can and cannot say to any non-mason. This clear distinction makes it a lot easier to talk about the Craft in non-tyled places and with friends who are curious. According to the Handbook, there are really only two things (only one if you want to get technical about it) I can't share about Freemasonry: The details of Ritual and the Means of Recognition. I hold those secrets in my heart and my family understands completely because I have explained the reasons to them. I consider this being open and honest about the Craft with those I love while living up to my Obligation. I hope every GL produces a book like that and that each of us takes the time to read and understand it.
The GL of Florida has a series of books used for the Masonic Education of EA's all the way through to the Master Mason degree. The books are used along with catechism training. Of the things covered, all are viewable by your family and friends. The series covers Masonic Ettiquete, and the general do's and don't's of Freemasonry. I would imagine this type of material is available in most all the jurisdictions. I found the material exceptionally helpful in explaining Freemasonry to my family.
Yes we have a series of 5 books that can be purchased through the GL rather cheaply . One book is for those who just turned in their petition . There is a book for each degree . And one book for the Masons wife ethat xplains a little about Freemasonry , what it may do for her husband etc; etc; .
I think what you have as far as the marriage is a good thing...because...I believe if you can't trust the wife or husband..then the marriage is doomed already and its just a matter of time before it manifest in the physical. I also believe benign secrets do come out of the dark eventually it has too its the law of the universe. If a person have 'any' moral fiber in them that morale fiber will out with the secret! The only way the secret wont come out is if the person has 'no' morale fiber whatsoever and they have no consciousness when it comes to doing ill will towards people. Thats just my take on it.
