The Widows Sons - Masonic Motorcycle Riders

Bob Franks

Past District Deputy Grand Lecturer
It sounds to me like there are a few possible solutions to the problem:

The Grand Chapters could organize (perhaps a letter campaign) and insist that only regular (meaning here, not clandestine) Masons be allowed in, (snip)
Hmmm, who determines Regular?
If my Brother Jimmy F., the DDGM of the 12 District (MWPHGLNC) wants to form a club, it would not be regular to several southeastern US 'mainstream' GLs.:confused:
 

Winter

I've been here before
The PHA issue gets even more murky! At least they're not clandestine. They're regular, just unrecognized in many cases. It's getting better though. My GL recognizes 31 PHA GL's now.

As for the French issue, I believe that just belonging to the same organization as those pretenders violates my Ob. I hear people say that as long as you don't do any esoteric work with a clandestine you should be ok to socialize with them. Well, I call bull$hite on that one. I will have nothing to do with those individuals. If they were drowning, yes, I would render aid as I would for any human in distress, but don't ask me to smile to their face and pretend that they aren't clandestine.

Zero tolerance on my part where this issue is concerned. Feel free to disagree, and I wolcome your comments.

As to the WS organizing, that will most likely never happen, and some jurisdictions agreed, many more would not and they would be in the same boat as they are now. Already, some jurisdictions are upset because their GL doesn't recognize PHA and other jurisdictions that do are accepting members from the PHA in their states.
 

Ashlar2006

Masonic Mafia
No different from the Shrine , one of the reasons I am not a member . Cliques , power struggles for Potentate and other positions , black balling of good Masons because they are from a certain lodge etc; etc; . I don't care what they do as long as they keep it out of my Lodge .
 

Ashlar2006

Masonic Mafia
There will always be a few that tries to ruin it for everyone . I will not label everyone in these groups as bad or the groups themselves as bad , some want to help , some want to fellowship and some just want to have fun . But there will always be a small percentage out there who thinks they should be running the show .
 

Custer148

Masonic Traveler
There will always be a few that tries to ruin it for everyone . I will not label everyone in these groups as bad or the groups themselves as bad , some want to help , some want to fellowship and some just want to have fun . But there will always be a small percentage out there who thinks they should be running the show .
This month in Omaha, there was a Chief Rabban (like the VP) who was up for election to Potentate, he was not voted in. I heard later that he had done some underhanded things with some of the Temple's money that others found out about and decided to vote against him. In this case I agree with their actions as he may have done more underhanded things as Potentate and gotten the Temple into more trouble.
 
M

Martlet

Guest
I am leaving the Widows Sons. There are serious issues.

I am patching over to the "Ruffians Masonic Motorcycle Group"

Welcome to Facebook

If I could, I would form the first "Freemasons MC"

(PM me if you think that is a good idea!)
I wish there were a Masonic MC, run as a traditional MC. I thought of starting one, but haven't garnered the interest yet.
 

Azpir8king

Member
I wish there were a Masonic MC, run as a traditional MC. I thought of starting one, but haven't garnered the interest yet.
Since we are all on the level as MM's, a traditional MC, requiring a "prospect" period is out of line with Masonic Values, so it would be a little difficult to be a TRUE Masonic MC. I also question the wisdom of riding in a "heavy" clubs area as an MC vs. an association. Again, MIGHT be (IMHO) an issue with your Obligation if you have to wear a "I support XXXX' in order to fly your colors.

I am trying to see the plus of a "traditional" MC vs and association of Masons riding together, other than the serious downsides and issues it can attract.:confused:
 
M

Martlet

Guest
Since we are all on the level as MM's, a traditional MC, requiring a "prospect" period is out of line with Masonic Values, so it would be a little difficult to be a TRUE Masonic MC. I also question the wisdom of riding in a "heavy" clubs area as an MC vs. an association. Again, MIGHT be (IMHO) an issue with your Obligation if you have to wear a "I support XXXX' in order to fly your colors.

I am trying to see the plus of a "traditional" MC vs and association of Masons riding together, other than the serious downsides and issues it can attract.:confused:
There are many traditional MCs without a prospect period, as they come from a common background, ie: veteran's and LEO MCs. These groups also claim no territory, nor announce support to the dominant club.

There aren't any down sides that i can think of, neither are there many up sides. The biggest would be acceptance and support from MCs in rides and fund raising activities.
 

Azpir8king

Member
There are many traditional MCs without a prospect period, as they come from a common background, ie: veteran's and LEO MCs. These groups also claim no territory, nor announce support to the dominant club.

There aren't any down sides that i can think of, neither are there many up sides. The biggest would be acceptance and support from MCs in rides and fund raising activities.
HOG, Goldwing riders, Star and a number of other associations enjoy that support for their events WITHOUT the tag or the problems associated with formally declaring yourself an MC. There are hundreds if not thousands fo events put on that have NO affiliation with a club or association at all. it buys you nothing.

Also, one members action as part of an association does not JEOPARDIZE the safety of of another member within the MC community. The same cannot be said the other way around.

As far as "non-prospecting" clubs...I have not run across a real club that doesn't prospect. The confederations of MC in most regions require it, otherwise you are more of an association or "road bait".

In the end, there is no reason for the Widows Sons to become an MC, either. None. Its an ego thing. Also, becoming an MC would jeopardize relationships with numerous GL's. Those individual MM's that want to join MC's should form one and quit trying to shape the Widows Sons organization into something its not and screwing up the whole thing for everyone.IMHO.
 
M

Martlet

Guest
HOG, Goldwing riders, Star and a number of other associations enjoy that support for their events WITHOUT the tag or the problems associated with formally declaring yourself an MC. There are hundreds if not thousands fo events put on that have NO affiliation with a club or association at all. it buys you nothing.
I've been a member of the motorcycle community in this area for quite some time. I cantbthink of a single association that turns out the support of an MC. Not one.

Also, one members action as part of an association does not JEOPARDIZE the safety of of another member within the MC community. The same cannot be said the other way around.
You've been watching too many movies. The actions of a member of any group represent the group. MC or not. Don't believe me? Pull some crap at an HAMC, or other, event wearing the patch of an association or MC. See what happens. Being an association instead of an MC doesn't free you from resposibility or your members.

As far as "non-prospecting" clubs...I have not run across a real club that doesn't prospect. The confederations of MC in most regions require it, otherwise you are more of an association or "road bait".
I have. Most veteran and LEO clubs could not care less what the dominant club "requires".

In the end, there is no reason for the Widows Sons to become an MC, either. None. Its an ego thing. Also, becoming an MC would jeopardize relationships with numerous GL's. Those individual MM's that want to join MC's should form one and quit trying to shape the Widows Sons organization into something its not and screwing up the whole thing for everyone.IMHO.
I never said Widows Sons should become an MC. I said I wish that there were a Masonic MC. M
 

Azpir8king

Member
Not movies, experience, I have been part of, involved in and covering the Biker/MC/Motorcycling community for 20 years. Completely disagree across the board. You have your opinion, I have mine.

As far as "non support" from Clubs...There are plenty of poker runs and charity events put on by organizations that get club support in the form of some turnout ONCE THEY ARE INVITED. Most organizer's do not understand the protocol or the allowances that can be made. That is a circumstance of the organizing group promotions, not whether they are an MC or not.

The poke about the WS is because that is the origin of this thread. I was clarifying so there is no confusion for those that came into the thread to read about Widows Sons and then get the impression WE are thinking about becoming an MC.
 
M

Martlet

Guest
Not movies, experience, I have been part of, involved in and covering the Biker/MC/Motorcycling community for 20 years. Completely disagree across the board. You have your opinion, I have mine.

As far as "non support" from Clubs...There are plenty of poker runs and charity events put on by organizations that get club support in the form of some turnout ONCE THEY ARE INVITED. Most organizer's do not understand the protocol or the allowances that can be made. That is a circumstance of the organizing group promotions, not whether they are an MC or not.

The poke about the WS is because that is the origin of this thread. I was clarifying so there is no confusion for those that came into the thread to read about Widows Sons and then get the impression WE are thinking about becoming an MC.
It's not a matter of opinion. It's a matter of experience. Perhaps things are just different geographically.
 

Bob Franks

Past District Deputy Grand Lecturer
MC?

Pardon me, but it's been 30+ years since I sold the R69.
There seem to be some terms and phrases used in this thread that I think mean more than I know:
Traditional MC
riding club
road bait

"There are many traditional MCs without a prospect period, as they come from a common background, ie: veteran's and LEO MCs. These groups also claim no territory, nor announce support to the dominant club." Huh??

"Pull some crap at an HAMC, or other, event wearing the patch of an association or MC. See what happens." I don't know what this means,either.

S&F
 

Azpir8king

Member
Traditional MC - Motorcycle Club (usually refers to the 1% type clubs nowadays, although in the old days, it was just the rabble rousers and hard core partiers (Boozefighter MC, etc)
riding club- 50/50 on this sometimes means MC, sometimes means more of an assocaition. "Like" bikes, same job, etc riding together
road bait- An un-affiliated MC that can be screwed with with no ramifications from a larger club.

"There are many traditional MCs without a prospect period, as they come from a common background, ie: veteran's (Vets formed MC) and LEO (Law Enforcement officer) MCs. These groups also claim no territory, nor announce support to the dominant club." Huh?? Most clubs are reigned in under the Boss club through a network of commitments. The "baddest" 1% clubs tend to want to run legal and illegal activities within their turf. So, even if your club has no intentions of being 1%'ers, you need to show the Boss club that you are not a threat and have no affiliation with their rival clubs. They do not want to give the perception that just anyone cna run through their area without paying proper respect OR infringing on their enterprises.

"Pull some crap at an HAMC (Hells Angels Motorcycle Club), or other, event wearing the patch of an association or MC. See what happens."
 
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