GL of Florida

2SONDAD

2SONDAD

Husband, father, son, Mason.
I just read about the GM of Florida outlawing anyone who practices Wicca, Paganism, Odinism, Agnosticism and Gnosticism. Any current members professing those faiths must either resign or face trial. He based this on his interpretation of the Old Charges. He said they are incompatible with Masonic Law.

Thoughts? I'm still processing this and I'm not even in that jurisdiction.
 
Bob Franks

Bob Franks

Past District Deputy Grand Lecturer
I have a couple of thoughts.
Pagan is not a religion, but a term for any religion that is not Judaism, Christianity, or Muslim. I am not sure I can agree with this close interpretation. The others I don't know enough about to speculate on.
Different GLs seem to define different numbers of Old Charges, and of Ancient Landmarks.
Bro. Rudyard Kipling wrote of lodge meetings in India, where the officers were of faiths that were at each others throats outside the Lodge.
How did the GM become aware that there were Masons who were of these religions? I feel it is against our ways to ask beyond "Can you profess a belief in Deity?"
We should be very careful not to define our tent so small that good and honest men of religious belief other than our own are left outside the walls and excluded. Masonry "unites men of every country, sect, and opinion, and conciliates true friendship among those who otherwise might have remained at a perpetual distance."
Should we not bring men together by focusing on similarities instead of forcing them apart by pointing out differences?

OK, so I can't count...

S&F
 
Windrider

Windrider

Plus-sized tuxedo model
I was on the Investigative Committee for a man petitioning my lodge who is Wiccan. Shortly after the interview but before I had submitted my report to the lodge, I attended a Lodge of Instruction where the DDGM presented a short talk on the responsibilities of being a sponsor and member of the Investigation Committee. During the talk, one of the more elderly men in the room stood and proudly announced that he had blackballed a man because he was Wiccan. Being in the position I was and not wanting a good man to be excluded from the Fraternity because of a misunderstanding, I rose when recognized and explained what I knew of the Wiccan belief system. Wiccans do believe in many spirits but their faith culminates with the "Lord and Lady" or "God and Goddess" who are different aspects of a singular Supreme Being.

The older man insisted that Wiccans are polytheistic and therefore cannot be made Masons. I rose again and asked the DDGM, "Would a man who worships three gods and practices ritual cannibalism during his worship service be qualified to become a Mason?" The answer was, "Of course not!"
I then said, "Then I would respectfully request that you now collect all the Christians' dues cards because looking at just the surface of Christianity, that's an accurate description. We owe every man the respect to allow him to explain his faith if we are not familiar with it."

Behind me, the presenter for the evening rose and said, "He's right! I'm a Unitarian and that's a perfect description of a Trinitarian faith." This man probably saved me as he is a very well respected Mason who was presenting the Regis Poem and the Ancient Charges.

I met with my minister who offered to come with me to any future meeting and explain Wicca and later the DDGM. The result was the DDGM, who had consulted with the Grand Master, told me that so long as the Petitioner could explain his faith in the way I had outlined including the singular Supreme Being, he would be accepted.

Lodges of Instruction are untyled meetings of Masons for education. What goes on in them is meant to be discussed.
 
2SONDAD

2SONDAD

Husband, father, son, Mason.
The part I thought was interesting was saying that Gnostics weren't allowed.

I admit to not knowing a lot about Gnosticism, but I was under the impression that it was related to Christianity in some aspects. I may be wrong but wouldn't Jesus' relationship to G-d be a Gnostic view?

Perhaps someone with more knowledge on the subject can impart some wisdom.

I guess what bothers me is that he is saying that brothers who were voted on, accepted and raised in good faith have to resign now or face charges. The only thing that changed was the GM's interpretation. These poor brothers didn't do anything. Their faith was known when they were made Masons.

Isn't it wrong to penalize them after the fact?
 
Bob Franks

Bob Franks

Past District Deputy Grand Lecturer
Why does this become a monotheistic requirement?
Certainly Unitarians view Trinitarian Christians as polytheistic!
Kipling wrote of Hindus holding officer positions in a Lodge he attended in India. Does this mean my friend and former colleague "Sri," a good and honest man, and a devout Hindu worshiping Shiva, could not submit a petition? [He has not expressed an interest...]
Does GL-FLA now exclude members of the LDS church? I am told that part of their beliefs include that God was once man as we now are, and that men may attain the status of a god and have their own creation. [I do NOT have absolute knowledge of this.] This would be polytheistic, and exclude one of the best ritualists in my mother Lodge and who later served as Grand Master in that jurisdiction.

As long as you can "profess a belief in Deity," I believe you can be a Mason.
Keep your religion to yourself in Lodge matters. We have long known this is too divisive a subject for Masonic discussion, as is politics! Would they exclude me as a registered libertarian?

S&F
 
jason

jason

Seanchaí
Staff member
Bob Franks said:
As long as you can "profess a belief in Deity," I believe you can be a Mason.
S&F
Click to expand...
Not sure if this helps answer your question.
From the GL Website:
Do you believe in God?
No atheist can be a Mason. Masons do not care what your individual faith is -- that is a question between you and your God -- but we do require that a that a man believe in a Supreme Being.

http://www.glflamason.org/grandlodge/join.html


Maybe they will be updating it though.
 
Gary2112

Gary2112

Troll Stomper
Staff member
2SONDAD said:
Interesting read. Great open letter by Brother Porter. Very educational and breaks down the argument against the GM's position very well. It even answered my question about Gnosticism.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately, the one who needs to read it the most won't likely ever see it.
 
Winter

Winter

I've been here before
This ruling from the GMofFL is very saddening to me. Such a narrow interpretation of belief in Deity only works against us. I'm still floored by the decision.
 
Duncan1574

Duncan1574

Lodge Chaplain & arms dealer
Bob Franks said:
Why does this become a monotheistic requirement?
Certainly Unitarians view Trinitarian Christians as polytheistic!
Kipling wrote of Hindus holding officer positions in a Lodge he attended in India. Does this mean my friend and former colleague "Sri," a good and honest man, and a devout Hindu worshiping Shiva, could not submit a petition? [He has not expressed an interest...]
Does GL-FLA now exclude members of the LDS church? I am told that part of their beliefs include that God was once man as we now are, and that men may attain the status of a god and have their own creation. [I do NOT have absolute knowledge of this.] This would be polytheistic, and exclude one of the best ritualists in my mother Lodge and who later served as Grand Master in that jurisdiction.

As long as you can "profess a belief in Deity," I believe you can be a Mason.
Keep your religion to yourself in Lodge matters. We have long known this is too divisive a subject for Masonic discussion, as is politics! Would they exclude me as a registered libertarian?

S&F
Click to expand...
The LDS are not friendly towards Freemasonry even though many of thier initiation rituals would look familiar (seems many of the founding Mormons were Brothers).
Brother Bob, you're knowledge is accurate (my sister was LDS for most of my youth).
 
Winter

Winter

I've been here before
Here is a follow up article on the matter. I really want to hear the GM's side of all this. I want to know if the unMasonic comments happened. And what the justification was for the GM of Florida not following the Constitution of Florida. Also, are there any Florida Brothers here that can fill me in on the PHA edict by the FL GM that is talked about in this article? As a Wisconsin Mason I enjoy excellent relations with my PHA Brothers and would hate to land in hot water if I affiliated with a FL Lodge.

http://networkedblogs.com/FKUbm
 
Gary2112

Gary2112

Troll Stomper
Staff member
Winter said:
Here is a follow up article on the matter. I really want to hear the GM's side of all this. I want to know if the unMasonic comments happened. And what the justification was for the GM of Florida not following the Constitution of Florida. Also, are there any Florida Brothers here that can fill me in on the PHA edict by the FL GM that is talked about in this article? As a Wisconsin Mason I enjoy excellent relations with my PHA Brothers and would hate to land in hot water if I affiliated with a FL Lodge.

http://networkedblogs.com/FKUbm
Click to expand...
The PHA edict is true. The PHA issue has come up many times in legislation. It never passes. Don't ask me why, because I would only be speculating.
 
jaya

jaya

Active Member
Bob Franks said:
Why does this become a monotheistic requirement?
Click to expand...
It is stated in our Code that it is monothestic. The following is taken from the NC Code in Chapter 1:


III. DECLARATION OF PRINCIPLES:
Pursuant to the settled policy of this Grand Lodge to define and reaffirm, from time to time, certain of the fundamental principles and rules of conduct governing the practice of Freemasonry in this Masonic jurisdiction, it is declared that:

.....
5. It is religious in that it teaches monotheism, the Holy Bible is open upon its altars whenever a lodge is in session, reverence for God is ever present in its ceremonial, and to its brethren are constantly addressed lessons of morality; yet it is not sectarian or theological.
Click to expand...
http://www.grandlodge-nc.org/masoniccode/chapter-0
 
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