What would YOU like to see changed in Masonry?

[cemab4y]

Here is a quote from Thomas Jefferson (NOT a freemason)

"I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times."

What do YOU think?

 

[CoachN]

I think he was a Mason.

 

[DavisB]

I think he was a Mason.

I think he probably was too. Unfortunately I do not believe there is any evidence to support that...

 

[Azpir8king]

I think he probably was too. Unfortunately I do not believe there is any evidence to support that...

According to Bro Hodapp...he wasn't. He was actually a little prickly about Masons, although not so much as John Adams....

I agree that an institution can change its operations, how it approaches its goals and take advantage of modern methods to achieve its goals. HOWEVER, the institution (especially one that governs and is not driven by profit) ALSO has to remain true to its purpose and traditions, as well as its intent's, if they are indeed noble. Change for the sake of change is a waste of time and energy with very poor results.

 

[cemab4y]

The historical record is quite clear. T. Jefferson was not a Mason. The question is- What would YOU like to see changed? Are there any administrative or procedural changes, that we could make, while still keeping true to our ancient landmarks?

I would love to see our lodges/Grand Lodges making more productive use of the internet. I would love to see all lodges having the ability for members to pay dues on line.

I am not just pushing for haphazard change to the Fraternity, but reasonable, prudent changes, that will help us survive in the 21st Century, and make for a more meaningful Masonic experience.

Is it possible?

 

[CoachN]

The historical record is quite clear. T. Jefferson was not a Mason.

I guess it's a matter of what meaning one assigns to words.

The historical record might reflect no evidence that he was a Freeemason, but his track record clearly shows that he was one heck of a Mason -- perhaps one of the better ones ever. IMO

 

[Azpir8king]

I guess it's a matter of what meaning one assigns to words.

The historical record might reflect no evidence that he was a Freeemason, but his track record clearly shows that he was one heck of a Mason -- perhaps one of the better ones ever. IMO

Are you referring to his monuments and designs? I would say he is more of a great Architect and conceptualist. I don't have any proof of his ability to actually build and sculpt "hands on", as a Master Mason would.

As far as Masonic Principles...a number of our forefathers that WHERE NOT BROTHERS fit the mold for their enlightened thinking and innovative solutions, while staying the course using an as yet unknown democratic compass. It always make me contemplate their acheivements with a little awe.

Brother Hodapps "Solomon's Builders" is a great piece of work about this very subject. I recently finished it and actually gave it to my Daughter who is enjoying it right now.

 

[CoachN]

Are you referring to his monuments and designs? I would say he is more of a great Architect and conceptualist. I don't have any proof of his ability to actually build and sculpt "hands on", as a Master Mason would.

In part, that's the sign of a good Mason. Masons Build -- part of that is design. Monticello was a Masterpiece!

The other part goes with the saying that I've heard others mutter under their breath when faced with head shaking moments, "There may be a lot of Freemasons in this organization, but there are much fewer Masons." I know what this saying implies. I think it applies to TJ. He was a Masterful Mason. His Work in helping Build this nation, its schools, its declarations and its very foundation was Masterful. His tool was his mind and his connections with other Masterful Masons. He wielded all this Masterfully.

Something that I would change is whom we call a Mason. That's my thought.

 

[PatrickWilliams]

The historical record is quite clear. T. Jefferson was not a Mason. The question is- What would YOU like to see changed? Are there any administrative or procedural changes, that we could make, while still keeping true to our ancient landmarks?

I would love to see our lodges/Grand Lodges making more productive use of the internet. I would love to see all lodges having the ability for members to pay dues on line.

I am not just pushing for haphazard change to the Fraternity, but reasonable, prudent changes, that will help us survive in the 21st Century, and make for a more meaningful Masonic experience.

Is it possible?

First - the historical record is NOT all that clear. Back in the mid-80's the Scottish Rite Research group (of which I was a member at that time) published a paper which alleged that TJ was afforded 4 Masonic Funerals. Now ... how does one get a Masonic Funeral? Yes, that's right, one must BE a Master Mason. If, indeed, that info was correct, then it was quite possible that TJ WAS a Mason. The best we can say is that TJ's Masonic involvement has never been substantiated.

 

[PatrickWilliams]

Second- as to change: our Fraternity adopts change. It really does. It just does it extremely slowly. This is not a bad thing: it keeps us from jumping on some fad, or from making changes that we will someday regret (of course, not always, but most of the time). It's also quite frustrating at the same time: it keeps us from making changes that we all believe are important.

You wrote:

I would love to see our lodges/Grand Lodges making more productive use of the internet. I would love to see all lodges having the ability for members to pay dues on line.

More and more Grand Lodges (as well as constituent Lodges) ARE making 'more productive use of the internet.' This is happening. And I think that in time, there will be more and more use of the 'net within freemasonry.

 

[CoachN]

First - the historical record is NOT all that clear. Back in the mid-80's the Scottish Rite Research group (of which I was a member at that time) published a paper which alleged that TJ was afforded 4 Masonic Funerals. Now ... how does one get a Masonic Funeral? Yes, that's right, one must BE a Master Mason. If, indeed, that info was correct, then it was quite possible that TJ WAS a Mason. The best we can say is that TJ's Masonic involvement has never been substantiated.

Yep. I have a hardbound copy of a 1917 edition of Mackay's "Encyclopedia of Freemasonry" that shows the following on it's very last page (pg. 1046):

The Masonic Presidents ..

Thomas Jefferson, made a Mason in colonial times, attended lodge of Nine Sisters in Paris, France, with Thomas Paine, during French Revolution.

I think it's safe to say that TJ might well have been a Freemason. I don't think it's safe to claim that he wasn't.

Either way, he was a Mason to me.

 

[PatrickWilliams]

Yep. I have a hardbound copy of a 1917 edition of Mackay's "Encyclopedia of Freemasonry" that shows the following on it's very last page (pg. 1046):

The Masonic Presidents ..

Thomas Jefferson, made a Mason in colonial times, attended lodge of Nine Sisters in Paris, France, with Thomas Paine, during French Revolution.

I think it's safe to say that TJ might well have been a Freemason. I don't think it's safe to claim that he wasn't.

Either way, he was a Mason to me.

Indeed. I think it's quite probable that Jeff became a Freemason in France. If I remember correctly, that's where Ben Franklin became a Mason. Now, as to his involvement in Freemasonry in our country? As far as I know, there's no record of any.

 

[removed12612]

Thanks Bro Coach & Bro Patrick on the history lessons...very interesting!!!

Charles.....ALL Lodges have the ability to allow on-line dues payments.....I dont think it should be mandatory or should the GL control it.

 

[cemab4y]

I belong to Bowling Green Lodge #73, Bowling Green KY (Grand Lodge of KY F&AM). My lodge does not have the ability to accept dues payments on line. It is unlikely, that my lodge will move to this option in the near future. The Grand Lodge of Pennsylvania made a deal with

http://www.payliance.com

so that every lodge in the entire state, now has the ability to accept online dues payments. Members can also stretch out their payments over an entire year.

This would not have happened without direction and initiative from the Grand Lodge.

The Grand Lodge of Ohio, has mandated that every lodge in the entire state, will have an internet page. (HOORAY). Not every lodge in Ohio was moving fast enough, so the GL put the "spurs" to them. As far as I know, Ohio is the first Grand Lodge, to mandate this. My home Lodge does not have an internet page, and has no plans to obtain one.

I predict that other Grand Lodges are going to follow Ohio's example, and drag Freemasonry into the internet age, with some lodges kicking and screaming every inch of the way.

SO mote it be!

 

[TrowelTalk]

What would I like to see changed..?

Get rid of the WM "Top Hat"... I visited a Lodge in New Orleans and the WM wore a black Fedora - way cool.

Weekly newsletters sent online from the Lodge and GL, letting us know what's going on, reminders, pictures, etc. Monthly or quarterly newsletters that look like they were written on a bad typewriter just don't cut the ice any more.

Monthly Lodge of Instruction/Research offered in every GL jurisdiction.

 

[CoachN]

I'd like to go to an Internet calander to see what Lodges are doing what on a specific day and time (especially if it's a presentation about Brother TJ )

 

[Duncan1574]

I'd like to go to an Internet calander to see what Lodges are doing what on a specific day and time (especially if it's a presentation about Brother TJ )

My GL is using Google calendars, as is my District, and my Lodge will be shortly as soon as I take over the website.

 

[Ashlar2006]

I belong to Bowling Green Lodge #73, Bowling Green KY (Grand Lodge of KY F&AM). My lodge does not have the ability to accept dues payments on line. It is unlikely, that my lodge will move to this option in the near future. The Grand Lodge of Pennsylvania made a deal with

Echeck Payment Processing | Payment Solutions | Debt Recovery Solutions

so that every lodge in the entire state, now has the ability to accept online dues payments. Members can also stretch out their payments over an entire year.

This would not have happened without direction and initiative from the Grand Lodge.

The Grand Lodge of Ohio, has mandated that every lodge in the entire state, will have an internet page. (HOORAY). Not every lodge in Ohio was moving fast enough, so the GL put the "spurs" to them. As far as I know, Ohio is the first Grand Lodge, to mandate this. My home Lodge does not have an internet page, and has no plans to obtain one.

I predict that other Grand Lodges are going to follow Ohio's example, and drag Freemasonry into the internet age, with some lodges kicking and screaming every inch of the way.

SO mote it be!

I am confused here . I have read your "Masonic Bill of Rights" threads out there where Masons (and subordinate lodges I take it ) could conduct business with LESS Grand Lodge interference and doing away with rules that lessens the grip of Grand lodges on it's members . But here is a Grand Lodge doing just that , interfering with the subordinate lodges business , and you are all for it because it is something you agree with . If it was the other way around and a Grand Lodge banned lodges from having web sites , you would be screaming bloody murder .

You can not have it both ways , either Grand Lodges allow their subordinate lodges to conduct their business as they see fit within the existing GL Code , or you are for Grand Lodges forcing their will on lodges at their whim . You can not have your cake and eat it too .

 

[mdonahue66]

What would I like to see changed..?

Get rid of the WM "Top Hat"... I visited a Lodge in New Orleans and the WM wore a black Fedora - way cool.

Weekly newsletters sent online from the Lodge and GL, letting us know what's going on, reminders, pictures, etc. Monthly or quarterly newsletters that look like they were written on a bad typewriter just don't cut the ice any more.

Monthly Lodge of Instruction/Research offered in every GL jurisdiction.

I think it's the WM's will and pleasure to choose his hat. Last year, our Grand Master, and Irish gentleman named McCarthy. He wore a derby. I think it was a derby.....maybe a bowler, I'm no expert on hats

 

[Laxguy38922]

I think it's the WM's will and pleasure to choose his hat. Last year, our Grand Master, and Irish gentleman named McCarthy. He wore a derby. I think it was a derby.....maybe a bowler, I'm no expert on hats

It depend on your GL, here in Pa it is just the top hat.