Freemasonry/Shrine

[Ashlar2006]

Another question I would like to pose .....

I have read comments that if the Shrine broke away from our Fraternity that Freemasonry would go into decline . I personally do not believe that , for one thing most Nobels I talk to say they would quit the Shrine . So that is not a problem . It is true some will demit from the Fraternity , but some only became Masons to get into the Shrine anyway and I have no problem with those types leaving Freemasonry . And yes , we may lose some petitioners because they too only want to become a Mason to get into the Shrine and I have no problem losing them neither . I am not in the Nobel making business , I studied my butt off to make Masons .

So , do you think if the Shrine finally made the break some so desperately wants , would it really hurt us that bad ?

 

[Ashlar2006]

OK , no takers . To expand on my question , are you for or against the Shrine going their own way and why ? What advantages would there be for both the Craft lodge and the Shrine , and what do you think would be the downfalls ?

 

[Gary2112]

I don't think it will hurt us at all. Quite the opposite. It will bring us back to the threshing floor, where we will separate the Masons from Shriners. Those who WANT to be Mason's are the ones we want anyways.

 

[Ashlar2006]

Yes , this is what I was alluding to in my OP . We will separate the Masons from the Shriners .

 

[cemab4y]

The Shrine was set up in 1872, to provide Masons with an organization to have fun and celebrations outside of Craft Masonry. The organization flourished. The first hospital was set up in 1922, fifty years later. I like to think of the Shrine as a "playground" for Masons. If the Shrine and Craft lodge split, it will be a disaster for both organizations. There have been rumors of a possible split for some years, but the idea has never took hold. Too many Masons (including myself) are opposed to a break.

See http://www.beashrinernow.com for more information.

also see:

http://zorahshrine.org/_Home_Dec_2011/Shriner_Primer.pdf

 

[Ashlar2006]

We do not need a history class on the Shrine , what I want to know is how exactly will it be a "disaster" for Freemasonry ? What do you base this on ?

 

[goomba]

I don't think it would hurt Masonry that much. I have no desire to join the Shrine for fun. The blue lodge rocks!!!

 

[jason]

So , do you think if the Shrine finally made the break some so desperately wants , would it really hurt us that bad ?

I would wonder if all those that complain about the Shrine and call them the Playboys of Freemasonry and generally look down on them will finally stop counting their charity numbers. Always interesting to see someone boost proudly how much money Freemasons donate and then go on to bash the Shrine who does the most money wise for charity.

It would be nice to see Lodges step up and start doing some charitably work in their community also and stop relying on the Shrine.

I think they would also get more members then they would loose from the break.

 

[Gary2112]

I would wonder if all those that complain about the Shrine and call them the Playboys of Freemasonry and generally look down on them will finally stop counting their charity numbers. Always interesting to see someone boost proudly how much money Freemasons donate and then go on to bash the Shrine who does the most money wise for charity.

It would be nice to see Lodges step up and start doing some charitably work in their community also and stop relying on the Shrine.

I think they would also get more members then they would loose from the break.

Well said.

I think that the Shrine does a majority of the charity that masonry boasts. The separation would only bring light to that fact. It would definitely be a wake up call for the Blue Lodge to start doing more in their own respective jurisdictions.

 

[Ashlar2006]

I would wonder if all those that complain about the Shrine and call them the Playboys of Freemasonry and generally look down on them will finally stop counting their charity numbers. Always interesting to see someone boost proudly how much money Freemasons donate and then go on to bash the Shrine who does the most money wise for charity.

It would be nice to see Lodges step up and start doing some charitably work in their community also and stop relying on the Shrine.

I think they would also get more members then they would loose from the break.

I agree with you completely Jason . One thing I never do is start boasting about the charities we support and use the Shrine as an example .

It would be a boon for the Shrine if they did break away , I know many who would love to be Shriners , they do not want to put in the work to be Masons .

 

[jason]

I think that the Shrine does a majority of the charity that masonry boasts.

Depends on the numbers you use but I generally hear 2/3 or 3/4 of the money Freemasons donate are done through the Shrine. Someone may have some better figures as I am running late today and only one coffee deep.

 

[jason]

I agree with you completely Jason . One thing I never do is start boasting about the charities we support and use the Shrine as an example .

It would be a boon for the Shrine if they did break away , I know many who would love to be Shriners , they do not want to put in the work to be Masons .

Went through the EA with someone who was a first responder and had made a promise to another to become a Shriner. Had no interested in being a 'Free'Mason. Very nice guy though, just negative and he did not proceed any further.

On a sort of side note, I run into people who believe that those evil 'Free'Masons worship the devil, want to steal our children and eat goats hearts or whatever. Yet they have nothing positive to say about Shriners. But has been mentioned before there are those who think of Shriners as those guys who drive funny cars and drink.

 

[Winter]

I've been saying for years that we need to stop counting the Shrine numbers in our totals. They are already a separate organization. Let them go their own way. Craft Masonry doesn't need a "playground." And we don't need an attendant body that refuses to be subordinate.

 

[Gary2112]

I've been saying for years that we need to stop counting the Shrine numbers in our totals. They are already a separate organization. Let them go their own way. Craft Masonry doesn't need a "playground." And we don't need an attendant body that refuses to be subordinate.

I disagree. Craft Masonry DOES need a playground. It just needs to build it on their own turf instead of using another body as the vehicle. If we address the needs of the Mason, the Mason won't need a pocket full of dues cards.

 

[Ashlar2006]

I think a good "Playground" for Freemasonry would be something along the lines of table lodges . Huge feasts , where all the Masons dress to the nines , converse about Freemasonry , converse about non-masonry subjects , drink wine , have toasts and cigars and scotch when it is over . We would not need to create a separate body , just take it upon ourselves and do it .

ETA: We do not need to have extra dues cards , charters , constitutions , some Grand/Imperial body to enjoy each other's company .

 

[jason]

I think a good "Playground" for Freemasonry would be something along the lines of table lodges . Huge feasts , where all the Masons dress to the nines , converse about Freemasonry , converse about non-masonry subjects , drink wine , have toasts and cigars and scotch when it is over .

I prefer Irish Whiskey. Or something else that shall not be named.

 

[Gary2112]

I prefer Irish Whiskey. Or something else that shall not be named.

That last sentence will have the conspiracy theorists salivating.

Give me a good Scotch. Personally, I love the 18 year cask strength Macallan.

 

[jason]

That last sentence will have the conspiracy theorists salivating.

I know nothing. I am sure it is not as good as others though but it does the trick.

To derail the subject slightly further, any mead drinkers here? Got a hold of this stuff and after the first sip or two I've grown a liking to it. The hibiscus and hops give it a flavor that some many not care for, but I think it is more of an old world flavor. How I would imagine beer tasted before it was made with hops and barley.

 

[Gary2112]

I know nothing. I am sure it is not as good as others though but it does the trick.

To derail the subject slightly further, any mead drinkers here? Got a hold of this stuff and after the first sip or two I've grown a liking to it. The hibiscus and hops give it a flavor that some many not care for, but I think it is more of an old world flavor. How I would imagine beer tasted before it was made with hops and barley.

Id be a mead drinker if I could ever get a sample. I'm too chicken to brew some and then find out it might not be my thing. LOL

That link does look interesting. PM your source for that, and maybe I'll buy some to try!

 

[Ashlar2006]

I don't think it would hurt Masonry that much. I have no desire to join the Shrine for fun. The blue lodge rocks!!!

Exactly , I never understood why the Shrine in it's original form needed to be created in the first place . Why must Masons need an entire body to have "fun" . My brethren/friends have a great time together and do not have to pay dues and wear a fez (you couldn't pay me to wear one) . We take it upon ourselves to create our own "playground" .

But I am still waiting to hear WHY it would be a disaster for the Fraternity if the Shrine broke ties with us .